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With all the chatter in the library, I almost didn't hear it, but:
Fifi wrote: "So, if your aim is to up the number of users on tribe, promoting it outside of tribe would be the way to go"
Increase, augment, enhance; all fine verbs. But up? Checking and thinking confirmed that this use is of course perfectly legitimate, if not the verb I would have chosen, but got me to wondering: why did 'up' get promoted from adverb to verb while 'down' languishes in adverb territory? And do you know of any other similar antagonistic and asymmetric couples?
Fifi wrote: "So, if your aim is to up the number of users on tribe, promoting it outside of tribe would be the way to go"
Increase, augment, enhance; all fine verbs. But up? Checking and thinking confirmed that this use is of course perfectly legitimate, if not the verb I would have chosen, but got me to wondering: why did 'up' get promoted from adverb to verb while 'down' languishes in adverb territory? And do you know of any other similar antagonistic and asymmetric couples?
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 12:00 PMwell,- the american oxford dictionary claims this:
down
"verb [ trans. ] informal
1 knock or bring to the ground : 175 enemy aircraft had been downed | he struck Slater on the face, downing him.
2 consume (something, typically a drink) : he downed five pints of cider.
• (of a golfer) sink (a putt)." -
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 12:31 PMtouché.
I still don't like 'to up something' , but it looks like my platform is crumbling. -
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 3:39 PMThen again, one might be guilty of one-upmanship, but I never heard of one-downmanship.
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 3:56 PMHowever, one can put someone down...though that has some alarming potential meanings!
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 3:54 PMmichael - Touché. It is indeed a bastardization of the English language (whether it's "legal" or not). It's in common usage in business environments, the source of many brutal crimes against language. -
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 5:21 PMYou can also put down a pet. -
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 7:22 PMNow that I think of it, there is plethora of uses for both down and up in modified verb forms.
downsize
downgrade
down with man
up the ante
upsell
I'm sure that I'll wake up in the middle of the night with even more examples.
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Re: Up is the new down
Mon, November 24, 2008 - 5:54 AMHeather - My apologies, I just realized you'd noted "up the ante". -
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Re: Up is the new down
Mon, November 24, 2008 - 6:58 AMNo problems. We're all here to enjoy the nerdy word discussions. Well, I think that applies to all of us. :-)
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Re: Up is the new down
Mon, November 24, 2008 - 5:21 AMExactly! It can get kind of sinister.
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Re: Up is the new down
Sun, November 23, 2008 - 7:26 PMGoing off on a tangent, and just to be slightly annoying to dear Fifi... Why is "let's progress America" wrong, "up the number of users" is acceptable? They seem to be rather similar alterations of officially proper grammar to me. :-)
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Re: Up is the new down
Mon, November 24, 2008 - 5:53 AMIt's not annoying to me at all, Heather! This is just the kind of nerdy discussion about language I love having. From the outset, I don't consider either to be a proper use of the English language. Though there seems to be precedent for using up in this way regarding betting..."up the ante" and "up the stakes". There does seem to be a well established usage of "up" in this way so it's not a neologism, whether it's technically correct or not. Feel free to destroy my argument, I won't take it personally!
I live and work in a bilingual environment so sometimes linguistic lines get crossed. You should hear how we eviscerate English in Quebec as chatter on in Franglais! It's not an excuse. Well, yes it is but not one I expect to pass muster. Please just keep in mind that some business language used here in Quebec might not apply elsewhere and may be a result of working in Franglais. That said, I believe that "up users" is commonly used in the world of online marketing and promotion across North America (though I could be wrong so welcome corrections). If one allowed oneself to be upset by business/working English, one would go insane within an hour!
So, ultimately, while neither is proper English (to my ears), one is in common business usage and the other is a neologism...or simply poor grammar. To make excuses for my poor behavior in foisting the phrasing upon you, once Micheal had called me on using "up users" I found it to be an unattractive way to express the concept, though I do offer up that I was *thinking* in a business mode so the business usage popped into my head and then escaped down my arms to the keyboard while I was distracted by tactical thinking about websites. That's my story and I'm sticking to it! I will not progress the story beyond this point....mouhahahaha. But seriously, "to progress America" sounds like "process America" to me or the progress of a chronic disease. Is it even possible to "progress" something or someone? -
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Re: Up is the new down
Tue, November 25, 2008 - 7:54 PMPersonally, I am hoping to grow my understanding of each of these concepts under discussion. -
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Re: Up is the new down
Wed, November 26, 2008 - 5:17 AMBill, may I offer you some fertilizer to help encourage you as you "grow your understanding"! Hopefully these discussions will be fecund ground for learning and fruitful for you... ;-)
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